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Who Is Telling the Truth?

Topic 15 · Grades 6–8 · Logic puzzles

What this builds on from class
  • Grade 7: Set (members of a set)
In this unit 7 sections
  1. Try every case
  2. What’s going on
  3. Asking questions
  4. Where the rule breaks
  5. A story, and where logic is used
  6. Questions
  7. Where to go next

Far out in a lake there is an island, in a story at least, where every person is one of two kinds. Truth-tellers only ever say true things. Liars only ever say false things: not mostly false, not false when it suits them, but false every single time. From the outside the two kinds look exactly alike.

Your boat lands on the shore, and two islanders, Asha and Bikash, are sitting under a tree. You ask them politely what kind of people they are. Bikash says nothing. Asha looks up and answers in just two words: “Both liars.”

That is all you get. Can two words really tell you who is who?

Guess first. Asha says: “We are both liars.” What are Asha and Bikash?

Pick an answer to see why.

Try it yourself. Tap each islander to guess what they are. Once everyone has a guess, the widget checks every statement against it: a truth-teller’s words must be true, and a liar’s must be false.

Try it

Two islanders

Start with Puzzle 1, Asha’s two words. Make a guess, see whether it fits, then try a different guess. When you think you have the answer, press Check every case. Then try Puzzles 2 to 4.

Puzzle:
  • Asha: “We are both liars.” Fits? Guess everyone first. ✓ True, from a truth-teller: fits. ✓ False, from a liar: fits. ✗ True, from a liar: can’t be. ✗ False, from a truth-teller: can’t be.

Tap each person to guess: truth-teller or liar. Then see whether their words fit.

Now guess everyone else too.

Everyone’s words fit this case. Is it the only case that does? Try the others, or check every case.

This case can’t be: ’s words don’t fit it. Tap someone to try another case.

Exactly one case fits, so it must be the true one: Asha lies, Bikash tells the truth.

1 cases fit, so the words don’t decide: you can’t tell who is what.

No case fits! Nobody on the island, truth-teller or liar, could say that.

Every case (T: truth-teller, L: liar)
AshaBikashFits?
TT?
TL?
LT?
LL?

Try every case

Four possible islands

With two islanders, there are only four ways things could be. Asha is a truth-teller or a liar, and for each of those, Bikash is a truth-teller or a liar: 2 × 2 = 4 cases. A puzzle is solved when you know which case is the real one.

The rule for testing a case is always the same. Take each thing someone says. Work out whether it is true in that case. Then check it against the speaker:

The words are… said by a truth-teller said by a liar
true fits ✓ can’t happen ✗
false can’t happen ✗ fits ✓

A case survives only if every statement fits. Here is Asha’s “We are both liars” through all four cases:

Asha Bikash “We are both liars” is… Does it fit?
truth-teller truth-teller false ✗ a truth-teller said something false
truth-teller liar false ✗ a truth-teller said something false
liar truth-teller false ✓ a liar said something false
liar liar true ✗ a liar said something true

Exactly one case is left standing, so it must be the real one. This is slow, but it can’t go wrong: nothing is missed, because every case is on the list.

Puzzle 2: Asha says, “At least one of us is a liar.” What are they?

Pick an answer to see why.

When two people speak

Puzzle 3: Asha says, “We are the same kind.” Bikash says, “We are different kinds.” What are they?

Pick an answer to see why.

Three islanders

On the other side of the island, three people are fishing: Asha, Bikash and Chandra (yes, the same names are popular there too). With three people each case is a choice for each of them: 2 × 2 × 2 = 8 cases.

Try it

Three islanders

Puzzle 1 can be solved in your head by following a chain: start by guessing Asha, and see what that forces for Bikash, then for Chandra. Puzzles 2 and 3 are easier to check case by case. Check every case when you are done, and see whether exactly one fits.

Puzzle:
  • Asha: “Bikash is a liar.” Fits? Guess everyone first. ✓ True, from a truth-teller: fits. ✓ False, from a liar: fits. ✗ True, from a liar: can’t be. ✗ False, from a truth-teller: can’t be.
  • Bikash: “Chandra is a liar.” Fits? Guess everyone first. ✓ True, from a truth-teller: fits. ✓ False, from a liar: fits. ✗ True, from a liar: can’t be. ✗ False, from a truth-teller: can’t be.
  • Chandra: “Asha and Bikash are both liars.” Fits? Guess everyone first. ✓ True, from a truth-teller: fits. ✓ False, from a liar: fits. ✗ True, from a liar: can’t be. ✗ False, from a truth-teller: can’t be.

Tap each person to guess: truth-teller or liar. Then see whether their words fit.

Now guess everyone else too.

Everyone’s words fit this case. Is it the only case that does? Try the others, or check every case.

This case can’t be: ’s words don’t fit it. Tap someone to try another case.

Exactly one case fits, so it must be the true one: Asha lies, Bikash tells the truth, Chandra lies.

1 cases fit, so the words don’t decide: you can’t tell who is what.

No case fits! Nobody on the island, truth-teller or liar, could say that.

Every case (T: truth-teller, L: liar)
AshaBikashChandraFits?
TTT?
TTL?
TLT?
TLL?
LTT?
LTL?
LLT?
LLL?

What’s going on

Every statement is true or false

Puzzles like these are logic puzzles: no numbers to work out, only what follows from what. The whole island rests on one idea that mathematicians use all the time. A statement is a sentence that is either true or false, never both, never neither. “Bikash is a liar” is a statement. “Go away!” and “Is it raining?” are not.

And on this island, a person and their words are tied together: someone’s statement is true exactly when that someone is a truth-teller. Every puzzle is that one rule, applied to each speaker.

You have met something like this in Grade 7, in sets. Call the set of truth-tellers on the island T and the set of liars L. Every islander is a member of exactly one of them, so L is everything outside T. In the opening puzzle, T = {Bikash} and L = {Asha}. A case is just a choice of who goes into T: with two islanders there are 4 such choices, with three, 8, and each new islander doubles the number, because each old case splits into two. Ten islanders would mean 1,024 cases. That is why, past a few people, you need a cleverer way than writing them all down.

Two ways of proving

Look at what you did in the puzzles. Two methods came up, and both are among the most important tools in all of mathematics.

Proof by cases. List every possibility, rule out every one that fails, and see what is left. It is completely reliable, as long as the list really has every case. The tables above are proofs by cases. The tables of true and false that computer scientists use are called truth tables, and Grade 7 Computing builds them for AND, OR and NOT: Truth tables.

Proof by contradiction. Suppose something, follow where it leads, and if it leads to something impossible, your supposition was false. “If Asha were a truth-teller, she would be a liar” is a contradiction, so Asha is not a truth-teller. It sounds like a trick, but it is the usual way to prove that the primes never run out: see Is There a Biggest Prime Number?

You suppose Bikash is a truth-teller, and after a few steps you find that this means Bikash is a liar. What have you proved?

Pick an answer to see why.

What the opposite of a statement is

A liar’s words are false, so to use them you need the opposite of what was said. Opposites are trickier than they look.

  • The opposite of “We are both liars” is not “we are both truth-tellers”. It is “at least one of us is a truth-teller”.
  • The opposite of “At least one of us is a liar” is “neither of us is a liar”: both are truth-tellers.
  • The opposite of “Everyone here is a liar” is “at least one person here is a truth-teller”, not “everyone here tells the truth”.

“Both” and “at least one” swap when you take the opposite. Augustus De Morgan, a British mathematician born in Madurai, India, in 1806, wrote rules for this, and they are named after him; Grade 7 Computing shows one as a truth table in Truth tables.

A liar says: “Every student in my class has a phone.” What do you now know for sure?

Pick an answer to see why.

Asking questions

The useless question

Back at the tree, you would like to ask Asha a question instead of waiting for her to speak. The obvious one is: “Are you a truth-teller?”

But think about it. A truth-teller says Yes, truthfully. A liar says Yes, falsely. Every islander on the whole island gives the same answer, so that question tells you nothing at all.

A question whose answer you already know works much better. Ask, “Is 2 + 2 equal to 4?” A truth-teller says Yes, a liar says No, and the islander is unmasked by one word.

The fork in the road

Now a harder problem. You are walking to the island’s only village, and the path splits in two. One road goes to the village; the other goes into a forest. A guard stands at the fork, a truth-teller or a liar, you don’t know which. You may ask him one question that he can answer with Yes or No. What should you ask so that you can find the road, whatever he is?

Try it

One question at the fork

Tap a question to ask it. Then take a road and find out where it leads, and who the guard was. Each new guard is chosen at random, so try each question several times. When you think you know which questions work, press Show every case.

leftright???guard
Walks
0
Reached the village
0

The guard may be a truth-teller or a liar. You may ask one question. Tap it.

The guard says “” Which road will you take?

You reached the village! The guard was a liar. Was that luck, or did the answer tell you?

You walked into the forest. The guard was a liar. Try another guard, or another question.

“Does the left road go to the village?” fails: a Yes could come from a truth-teller with the village on the left, or from a liar with the village on the right. The question that works is a strange one:

“If I asked you ‘Does the left road go to the village?’, would you say yes?”

A truth-teller just answers truthfully: Yes if the village is on the left. Now follow the liar carefully when the village is on the left. Asked “Is it the left road?”, he would lie and say No. So the true answer to “would you say yes?” is No. But he lies about that too, and says Yes. The liar lies about his own lie, and the two lies cancel. When the village is on the right, the same happens the other way round: the truth-teller says No, and the liar, who would have lied “Yes”, lies about that and says No.

The truth-tellerIs it the left road?His answer: YesWould he say Yes?The truth: YesHe tells the truth:“Yes.”The liarIs it the left road?He would lie: NoWould he say Yes?The truth: NoHe lies about that:“Yes.”
Figure 15.1 The village is up the left road. The truth-teller is true both times; the liar would have lied “No”, and then lies about that: “Yes”. Whoever the guard is, Yes means left.

Figure 15.1 follows both guards. Whichever kind he is, Yes means left, and No means right. You don’t learn what the guard is, but you don’t need to: you learn the road.

This is a double negative: the opposite of the opposite is the original. Two minus signs make a plus, −(−5) = 5, for the same reason.

Another traveler asks the guard: “Would the other kind of islander say the left road goes to the village?” The guard answers Yes. Which road should the traveler take?

Pick an answer to see why.

Where the rule breaks

Words that tell you nothing

Not every puzzle has an answer. Try these, and count how many cases fit:

Try it

When the words don’t decide

In Puzzle 1 Asha says, “I am a truth-teller.” In Puzzle 2 she says, “Bikash is a liar.” In Puzzle 3 she says, “I am a liar.” Bikash says nothing in all three. Check every case each time.

Puzzle:
  • Asha: “I am a truth-teller.” Fits? Guess everyone first. ✓ True, from a truth-teller: fits. ✓ False, from a liar: fits. ✗ True, from a liar: can’t be. ✗ False, from a truth-teller: can’t be.

Tap each person to guess: truth-teller or liar. Then see whether their words fit.

Now guess everyone else too.

Everyone’s words fit this case. Is it the only case that does? Try the others, or check every case.

This case can’t be: ’s words don’t fit it. Tap someone to try another case.

Exactly one case fits, so it must be the true one: .

4 cases fit, so the words don’t decide: you can’t tell who is what.

No case fits! Nobody on the island, truth-teller or liar, could say that.

Every case (T: truth-teller, L: liar)
AshaBikashFits?
TT?
TL?
LT?
LL?

“I am a truth-teller” fits every case: a truth-teller says it truly and a liar says it falsely, just like the useless question. Asha could be either kind, and Bikash wasn’t even mentioned, so all four cases fit. “Bikash is a liar” fits two cases: either Asha tells the truth and Bikash lies, or Asha lies and Bikash tells the truth. You learn that they are different kinds, but not which is which.

A good logic puzzle is one where exactly one case fits. A maker of puzzles has to check that, by trying every case, just as you did.

Words nobody can say

Puzzle 3 is stranger: no case fits. If a truth-teller said “I am a liar”, it would be false; if a liar said it, it would be true. Nobody on the island can ever say it. So if you heard those words, you would know at once that the speaker was not one of our islanders at all: a visitor, perhaps, who lies only sometimes.

Off the island, the trouble gets worse. Take the sentence: “This sentence is false.” If it is true, then what it says holds, so it is false. If it is false, then what it says doesn’t hold, so it is true. This is the liar paradox, and it has puzzled thinkers for well over two thousand years. On the island, “I am a liar” simply can’t be said. But anyone can write “This sentence is false” on a piece of paper, and then the trouble is in the sentence itself. Thinkers have suggested many ways out; one is to say that such a sentence is neither true nor false, so it isn’t a statement at all. For more, see Can a Sentence Say It Is False? in Grades 9–12, below.

An islander says: “Everyone on this island is a liar.” What can you be sure of?

Pick an answer to see why.

A story, and where logic is used

Questions

Bikash is asked, “Are you a liar?” What does he answer?

Pick an answer to see why.

a.★

Asha says, “Bikash and I are both truth-tellers.” Bikash says, “Asha is a liar.” What are they?

Hint
Answer
b.★★

Asha says, “All three of us are liars.” Bikash says, “Exactly one of us is a truth-teller.” Chandra says nothing. What are all three?

Hint
Answer

On the evening of Bhai Tika, the last sel roti has gone from the kitchen. One of four children ate it, and only one of them tells the truth. Asha says, “Bikash ate it.” Bikash says, “Dipa ate it.” Chandra says, “I didn’t eat it.” Dipa says, “Bikash is lying.” Who ate the sel roti?

Pick an answer to see why.

c.★★

Bikash and Chandra disagree: Bikash says “Chandra is a liar” and Chandra says “Bikash is a liar”. Can you tell who is who? What do you know?

Hint
Answer
d.★★

Asha says, “Bikash is a liar.” Bikash says nothing. Mina solves it like this: “I tried Asha as a truth-teller, and everything fits: Bikash is a liar. So Asha is a truth-teller and Bikash is a liar.” What is wrong with Mina’s reasoning?

Hint
Answer
e.★★★

Asha says, “Bikash and Chandra both tell the truth.” Bikash says, “Asha is a liar.” Chandra says, “Bikash is a liar.” What are all three?

Hint
Answer
f.★★★

Asha says, “I am a liar and Bikash is a truth-teller.” Show that these words, unlike “I am a liar”, can be said on the island, and find out what both of them are.

Hint
Answer
g.★★★

At the fork, a third question also works: “Is it true that you are a truth-teller exactly when the left road goes to the village?” (That is: either you tell the truth and it is the left road, or you lie and it is not.) Check all four cases, and say what Yes means.

Hint
Answer

Where to go next

Where these facts come from
  • Knights and knaves named by Raymond Smullyan in What Is the Name of This Book? (1978); the “both knaves” and “same kind / different kinds” puzzles; asking a question whose answer you already know; the fork in the road and its two working questions; Goodman’s anonymous 1931 nobles and hunters in the Boston Post; Kraitchik’s Mathematical Recreations (1953), with an island of truthful and lying peoples (the article gives no source for the fork’s first appearance); the film Labyrinth (1986) and its guards’ question: Wikipedia, “Knights and Knaves”, read October 2026.
  • Smullyan’s birth (1919, Far Rockaway) and death (2017, aged 97), magician and concert pianist, PhD at Princeton (1959), Feynman his grade-school classmate in Far Rockaway, his books (What Is the Name of This Book? 1978, The Magic Garden of George B 2015, the last, A Beginner’s Further Guide to Mathematical Logic, 2017): Wikipedia, “Raymond Smullyan”, read October 2026.
  • The liar paradox (“This statement is false”), Eubulides in the 4th century BCE and his question, Epimenides’ “All Cretans are liars” not truly a paradox, Bhartrhari (late 5th century CE) and “everything I am saying is false”, after J. E. M. Houben, “Bhartṛhari’s solution to the liar and some other paradoxes”, Journal of Indian Philosophy 23 (1995), 381–401 (its page at Springer opened, the paper itself not): Wikipedia, “Liar paradox”, read October 2026.
  • The words सर्वं मिथ्या ब्रवीमि (sarvaṃ mithyā bravīmi) in the Vākyapadīya, Book 3, Sambandha-samuddeśa, verse 25: K. A. Subramania Iyer’s translation (1965) at Wisdom Library, read October 2026. (Linking the grammarian to Ujjain rests on a legend joining him with King Bharthari of Ujjain, so it is left out: Wikipedia, “Bhartṛhari”, read October 2026.)
  • The catuṣkoṭi’s four corners (is, is not, both, neither), developed by Nagarjuna: Wikipedia, “Catuṣkoṭi”; Nagarjuna’s place and dates uncertain, most scholars placing him in South India between the 1st and 3rd centuries CE: Wikipedia, “Nagarjuna”; both read October 2026.
  • Logic gates perform Boolean functions and build up to whole processors, which may have more than 100 million gates: Wikipedia, “Logic gate”, read October 2026.
  • The satisfiability problem; solvers that handle tens of thousands of variables and millions of conditions; uses in checking processor designs and software, planning and scheduling: Wikipedia, “Boolean satisfiability problem”, read October 2026.
  • De Morgan born in Madurai, India, on 27 June 1806: Wikipedia, “Augustus De Morgan”, read October 2026; his rule as a truth table: Grade 7 Computing, True or False: Logic (this site).
  • Every puzzle’s answer in this topic (the opening, the widget’s ten puzzles, the questions, the sel roti, the four fork questions in all four cases, the numbers of cases for 1 to 10 islanders) was found by trying every case in checks/textbooks/math-further-6-8/15/tmp/puzzles.py, and again by the reviewer in checks/textbooks/math-further-6-8/15/tmp/review/recheck.py.